John Wayne Exhibition Removed

Cypress said:
I did not say Marion Morrison (aka, fake stage name John Wayne) was not widely known.

I did not even say certain people (octogenarians and septuagenarians) may consider him a cultural icon.


What I said is that I doubt many Gen Xers or millennials consider him an icon, let alone even watch his crappy movies. And that trend of utter disregard for Marion's legacy is only going to accelerate in coming years.

And I said he was a terrible actor mostly known for acting in numerous B-list Hollywood films.

Collectively, at this point in history Marion really does not merit statues, monuments, and airports in his honor. He is just not that important anymore.
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Before John Wayne there was Tom Mix. Bet you never heard of him. He was the actor that got Wayne started in the business by the way. In his time (1905 to 1940 roughly) he was one of the biggest names in movies. Celebrity is fleeting. It always has been. Today's celebrity is tomorrow's forgotten idiot. Nothing new there.
 
archives said:
Correct, however there is a major difference, you don't see a lot of those who are Democrats coming out thirty years later and talking the tough guy macho military rhetoric, can't say the same for Trump, Limbaugh, O'Reilly, Cheney, etc
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RWers always like to rattle sabers...it's just that some are real warriors and the rest are chickenshit chickenhawks like "Trump, Limbaugh, O'Reilly, Cheney, etc".

How many past elected Democrat politicians were draft-dodgers besides Clinton? IIRC, Obama had one or two on his staff, but that's not the same.

FWIW, if a person is going to determine if our nation goes to war, they should have served in the military.
 
Cypress said:
I did not say Marion Morrison (aka, fake stage name John Wayne) was not widely known.

I did not even say certain people (octogenarians and septuagenarians) may consider him a cultural icon.


What I said is that I doubt many Gen Xers or millennials consider him an icon, let alone even watch his crappy movies. And that trend of utter disregard for Marion's legacy is only going to accelerate in coming years.

And I said he was a terrible actor mostly known for acting in numerous B-list Hollywood films.

Collectively, at this point in history Marion really does not merit statues, monuments, and airports in his honor. He is just not that important anymore.
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You don't get to speak for everyone. You only get to speak for you. You don't like John Wayne. That much is obvious. Your own personal opinion.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
Before John Wayne there was Tom Mix. Bet you never heard of him. He was the actor that got Wayne started in the business by the way. In his time (1905 to 1940 roughly) he was one of the biggest names in movies. Celebrity is fleeting. It always has been. Today's celebrity is tomorrow's forgotten idiot. Nothing new there.
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Don't forget Audie Murphy, he was truly a legend in WW2. He is also talking massive bollocks as True Grit, The Shootist, Liberty Vallance and Rooster Cogburn are great films as well.

https://www.military.com/off-duty/m...-murphy-american-war-hero-actor-advocate.html
 
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cawacko said:
This is such a weird argument. To each his own whether one likes him or not but dude is considered an American icon and still ranks in polls as one of the most popular actors of the 20th century decades after his death. And you question why a University with the top film school would want to honor him?

Maybe you’re just trolling, I don’t know.
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Arsecheese is just a miserable old sod, he can't help it!
 
Into the Night said:
You don't get to speak for everyone. You only get to speak for you. You don't like John Wayne. That much is obvious. Your own personal opinion.
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I literally cannot think of a single person in my life in the last 30 years - buddies, girlfriends, colleagues, dates, relatives - who said to me, "We should watch a John Wayne movie tonight!"
 
Cypress said:
I literally cannot think of a single person in my life in the last 30 years - buddies, girlfriends, colleagues, dates, relatives - who said to me, "We should watch a John Wayne movie tonight!"
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I agree. It's hard to watch one dimensional westerns. Give me the Spaghetti variety or Hud with complex scoundrels who do good sometimes.
Takes a lot of good acting, gore and smoking and drinking to cover up a ham handed morality tale. John Wayne is just a country strong rugged ugly mug.
His movies time has simply passed. I can't watch them. Except I do like True Grit, even his old version is nice.
 
Micawber said:
I agree. It's hard to watch one dimensional westerns. Give me the Spaghetti variety or Hud with complex scoundrels who do good sometimes.
Takes a lot of good acting, gore and smoking and drinking to cover up a ham handed morality tale. John Wayne is just a country strong rugged ugly mug.
His movies time has simply passed. I can't watch them. Except I do like True Grit, even his old version is nice.
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True Grit was okay. I have no desire to ever see it again.

As for the golden age of Hollywood, I will still be up for watching the Bogart and Ingrid Bergman classics, Casablanca, African Queen, Treasure of Sierra Madre.

As for the good guys-bad guys westerns, I prefer the Japanese take on that theme. Kurasawa's excellent Samurai movies come to mind. Lots of good Asian martial arts films on the whole good guys vs. bad guys theme
 
Cypress said:
True Grit was okay. I have no desire to ever see it again.

As for the golden age of Hollywood, I will still be up for watching the Bogart and Ingrid Bergman classics, Casablanca, African Queen, Treasure of Sierra Madre.

As for the good guys-bad guys westerns, I prefer the Japanese take on that theme. Kurasawa's excellent Samurai movies come to mind. Lots of good Asian martial arts films on the whole good guys vs. bad guys theme
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Yes I'm aware of Sergio Leone's grifting.... I still think Leone value added greatly, with the score, the gravitas of Clint,
Lee Van Cleef and Eli Wallach. Maybe it's not the cookie cutout thing, cuz a very much liked IpMan version one despite
his (Donny Yen?) utter perfection as a human and maximal skill.
 
Cypress said:
I literally cannot think of a single person in my life in the last 30 years - buddies, girlfriends, colleagues, dates, relatives - who said to me, "We should watch a John Wayne movie tonight!"
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Into the Night said:
Like I said. You need to get out more.
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Here is data.

Polling indicates Wayne's (Marion Morrison) popularity is waning and plummeting. Marion is still modestly popular among baby boomers. But his legacy and popularity plummets among GenXers and Millennials. I mean it completely craters. Those are irreversible tends. In a generation or two Marion Morrison will be on par with trivia questions. Prominent monuments to him at USC or anywhere else will look out of place.

https://today.yougov.com/topics/international/explore/actor/John_Wayne

The most telling thing about this poll is the correlation between John Wayne fans and other cultural icons they have an affinity for -- Wayne fans are also fans of Bonanza, Roy Rogers, Andy Griffith Show, and Charlie Daniels Band.

Wayne fans are dinosaurs, and that tells you right there that Marion Morrison's legacy is headed for oblivion.
 
Cypress said:
Here is data.

Polling indicates Wayne's (Marion Morrison) popularity is waning and plummeting. Marion is still modestly popular among baby boomers. But his legacy and popularity plummets among GenXers and Millennials. I mean it completely craters. Those are irreversible tends. In a generation or two Marion Morrison will be on par with trivia questions. Prominent monuments to him at USC or anywhere else will look out of place.

https://today.yougov.com/topics/international/explore/actor/John_Wayne

The most telling thing about this poll is the correlation between John Wayne fans and other cultural icons they have an affinity for -- Wayne fans are also fans of Bonanza, Roy Rogers, Andy Griffith Show, and Charlie Daniels Band.

Wayne fans are dinosaurs, and that tells you right there that Marion Morrison's legacy is headed for oblivion.
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Polls don't mean anything. You need to get out more.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
Before John Wayne there was Tom Mix. Bet you never heard of him. He was the actor that got Wayne started in the business by the way. In his time (1905 to 1940 roughly) he was one of the biggest names in movies. Celebrity is fleeting. It always has been. Today's celebrity is tomorrow's forgotten idiot. Nothing new there.
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Clint Eastwood is still popular. Maybe Orange County will rename the airport for him just to really stick it to John Wayne's legacy.
 
T. A. Gardner said:
Before John Wayne there was Tom Mix. Bet you never heard of him. He was the actor that got Wayne started in the business by the way. In his time (1905 to 1940 roughly) he was one of the biggest names in movies. Celebrity is fleeting. It always has been. Today's celebrity is tomorrow's forgotten idiot. Nothing new there.
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Never heard of Tom Mix. That speaks to the issue of deluding one's self into believing that pop culture individuals are destined for history and enshrinement as ever lasting icons.

Tom Hanks is a good actor and has been in better movies than John Wayne. I actually think his film legacy is stronger than Wayne's. But in 50 years, monuments of Tom Hanks would look out of place and mildly ridiculous.

There are only a few dozen American writers, poets, film makers who really have ground breaking and lasting impact on art and culture. If somebody is going to pay good money for a statue and display it in a public space, they probably should think about the legacy and lasting contributions of the individual they are publicly enshrining.
 
There is one memorial to Tom Mix where he was killed in a car crash. It's a forlorn stretch of rural highway in Arizona.

06_TomMixMemorial.jpg
 
T. A. Gardner said:
There is one memorial to Tom Mix where he was killed in a car crash. It's a forlorn stretch of rural highway in Arizona.

06_TomMixMemorial.jpg
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That is perfectly fine.

It is a modest memorial to the untimely and unfortunate death of a prominent actor.

I think there is a modest memorial for James Dean where he was killed on his motorcycle on California Highway 46.

The mistake Marion Morrison fans make with John Wayne is elevating him to a historic figure with a consequential and lasting legacy.

He was a mediocre actor who appeared in numerous B-list movies.

My theory for why Marion even found the purchase that he did, is there was a cottage industry dedicated to making Wayne a proxy in the Cold War and Culture wars of the 20 th century. Marion provided the caricature, the avatar of the moral fortitude, courage, and independent spirit that America wished to project about herself.
 
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