What happens if Biden gets his $15 minimum wage passed?

[Red Jenkins]

And why do you believe there will be fewer people working? Tell me the economic argument on which you base that statement. The exact opposite is actually true. Injecting more money into consumer spending CREATES jobs, it does not eliminate them.

I would submit youre looking at this from one perspective only. If I own pizza parlor the cost of hiring people is an expense no different that the cost of sauce or dough or toppings etc. When it costs more to get any of those cheaper alternatives are sought. I have to raise the cost of pizza because now it costs more to produce. I may try working with fewer employees if one leaves.

I see your point that with more money in their pocket people will spend more but I am not sure the demand for pizza will increase enough to make the increase financially feasible. Maybe I'm wrong but I doubt it.

 

[LV426]

Instead they passion the poverty issues to the Feds

A very good point!

So the question boils down to this: Do you want to spend less on social welfare programs, or more?

Because those programs are income-determinant, which means if you make a certain amount, your welfare gets cut off.

Raising wages to $15/hr would result in millions of people no longer relying on social welfare programs to bridge the gap between a minimum wage and a living wage.

Isn't that the goal????

 

[BattleofHodow]

A sizeable number of small businesses fail in their first 1-2 years (about 20%), not because of wages, but because of poor management.

A larger number of small businesses fail in their first 5 years (about 45%), not because of wages, but because of poor management.

An even LARGER number of small businesses fail in their first 10 years (about 65%), not because of wages, but because of poor management.

So...you sensing a theme????

Not everyone who starts a business is good at it. No one is entitled to start a business, either. All businesses are chartered by the state.




65% of small businesses fail by Year 10.





A $15/hr MW will be a stimulus to most of those businesses because the people who patron them are typically on the lower end of the income spectrum and thus, are the most likely to spend money once it gets to their pocket.

Rich people don't spend tax cuts, but poor people do spend nearly 100% of their wages.

Proof it's mostly poor management!?

Minimum wage increases help the big corporations.?

It helps them knock out smaller competition who can't afford as much.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

Good...there's no unifying with Nazis.

Agreed and thanks for once again asserting the uber-Liberal Democratic party considers over 74 million fellow Americans to be fucking Nazis. I have no doubt you equally scorn the over 2.8 million fellow Americans who didn't vote for Biden. Your hatred is no different than the Trumpian assholes, dude.

Considering how thin the margin the Democratic party has over American voters (only 51.3% voter support) and a single Senate seat loss away from losing the Senate again plus the seats you guys lost in the House, there isn't much to gloat about much less a reason to spread hate against about 77 million American voters, the "Nazis" you hate so much.

$20 says no sane Democratic candidate wants you on their campaign committee...
...and every Republican party member is hoping you are the Poster Child of Biden's Unity platform.

A better way is actual unity. Common ground. Get drunk and/or laid with each other as mutually consenting adults. Peace. Prosperity. Happiness.

 

[BattleofHodow]

A very good point!

So the question boils down to this: Do you want to spend less on social welfare programs, or more?

Because those programs are income-determinant, which means if you make a certain amount, your welfare gets cut off.

Raising wages to $15/hr would result in millions of people no longer relying on social welfare programs to bridge the gap between a minimum wage and a living wage.

Isn't that the goal????

Minimum wage doesn't seem to do much to increase wealth.

Wealth is generated by production.

If production doesn't increase then inflation will go up accordingly.

All minimum wage might do is temporarily decrease inequality.

Long term it hurts smaller businesses.

 

[LV426]

If I own pizza parlor the cost of hiring people is an expense no different that the cost of sauce or dough or toppings etc. When it costs more to get any of those cheaper alternatives are sought. I have to raise the cost of pizza because now it costs more to produce. I may try working with fewer employees if one leaves.

But you won't need to do that because more people will be buying pizzas from you because they have more money to spend on pizzas.

So if anything, you're going to need to expand in order to meet that demand, which means hiring more workers to make all the pizzas you're now selling to the people who can afford to buy more of them.

You should really take an Econ 101 course at your local community college, because you are not right about any of this.

 

[Red Jenkins]

Nah...I'd rather you tell us why you felt compelled to create this ID when you did.




Higher wages increase demand because people have more money to spend in the economy if their wages are increased.

This is what you learn in Econ 101.




The demand of all the people whose wages were raised who can now afford a pizza. So you are paying $15/hr for employees, but then those same employees are spending their money buying pizza from their own job...and they're buying more pizzas than before because they have more money to spend!

It's no different than what Henry Ford did with his workers; paying them a wage high enough that they could afford the product they make...THUS CREATING DEMAND.

He may have been a Nazi sympathizing monster, but Ford knew economics. Better than you.

So you have no idea what you're saying.

So the pizza will cost more as it costs more to produce. If they couldn't afford the pizza when it was cheaper does $15 an hour guarantee they can afford the pizza now at the higher price? And will any increase in demand make up for the increased cost of production? Do people always spend the extra money they get?

I suspect Ford knew more about economics than both you and me together so I'm not too suprised.

 

[LV426]

Proof it's mostly poor management!?

The article I linked to explains exactly why, poor management: https://www.investopedia.com/financ... to the U.S. Bureau,during the first 10 years.

Minimum wage increases help the big corporations.?

They help everybody because higher wages increases consumer demand.

Econ 101.

t helps them knock out smaller competition who can't afford as much.

Nope. Not at all. A well-run business shouldn't have these issues if they are offering a viable product at a competitive rate.

With the wage increase, a well-run business would try to capture those consumers.

A poorly-run business won't.

So the wage of the workers isn't even a factor in that.

 

[Sailor]

So you have no idea what you're saying.

So the pizza will cost more as it costs more to produce. If they couldn't afford the pizza when it was cheaper does $15 an hour guarantee they can afford the pizza now at the higher price? And will any increase in demand make up for the increased cost of production? Do people always spend the extra money they get?

I suspect Ford knew more about economics than both you and me together so I'm not too suprised.

Just the broke ones. Which is pretty much every Democrat demanding a government handout.

 

[Red Jenkins]

But you won't need to do that because more people will be buying pizzas from you because they have more money to spend on pizzas.

So if anything, you're going to need to expand in order to meet that demand, which means hiring more workers to make all the pizzas you're now selling to the people who can afford to buy more of them.

You should really take an Econ 101 course at your local community college, because you are not right about any of this.

Do you or have you ever owned a business? Just curious I'm not trying to be a jerk. I think the demand you are talking about, which I understand, depends in part on the difference between the current MW and the new $15.

 

[BartenderElite]

People will get paid more.

 

[BattleofHodow]

The article I linked to explains exactly why, poor management: https://www.investopedia.com/financ... to the U.S. Bureau,during the first 10 years.




They help everybody because higher wages increases consumer demand.

Econ 101.




Nope. Not at all. A well-run business shouldn't have these issues if they are offering a viable product at a competitive rate.

With the wage increase, a well-run business would try to capture those consumers.

A poorly-run business won't.

So the wage of the workers isn't even a factor in that.

An economy is based on production.

If you have a 15 dollar minimum wage & no production it's simply a paper economy.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/panosm...ll-businesses-across-america/?sh=2745518a6eb1

Federal Minimum Wage Hikes Could Crush Small Businesses Across America
uncaptioned
© 2019 Bloomberg Finance LP
More From Forbes
Federal minimum wage hikes could crush scores of small businesses across America, already pushed near the cliff by high rents and growing state and city labor regulations.

Minimum wage hikes are reaching a fever pitch lately in America. Politicians at all levels, federal, state, and local are racing to get the minimum wage to the “living wage” of $15.

The most recent push comes at the federal level, where there’s a proposal on the table for a $15 minimum wage by 2025.

 

[Noking]

Just the broke ones. Which is pretty much every Democrat demanding a government handout.

Poopeye your brain is broken.

 

[Sailor]

Do you or have you ever owned a business? Just curious I'm not trying to be a jerk. I think the demand you are talking about, which I understand, depends in part on the difference between the current MW and the new $15.

LMAO! That broke dick welfare collecting asshole cannot even hold a job!

 

[LV426]

Agreed and thanks for once again asserting the uber-Liberal Democratic party considers over 74 million fellow Americans to be fucking Nazis.

If you voted for a Nazi, that makes you a Nazi.

I don't make those rules, the Nazis did.

I have no doubt you equally scorn the over 2.8 million fellow Americans who didn't vote for Biden.

Oh you mean the white moderate bOtHsIdErIsTs who take absolutely no risky political stance on anything? Your 3P vote was a vote for Trump. Just FYI.

Considering how thin the margin the Democratic party has over American voters (only 51.3% voter support) and a single Senate seat loss away from losing the Senate again plus the seats you guys lost in the House, there isn't much to gloat about much less a reason to spread hate against about 77 million American voters, the "Nazis" you hate so much.

Ah, but we gained two Senate seats in the last 14 days, by margins larger than what Biden won by in this state. Republican turnout was down, Black turnout was up. So...are you going to ignore that?

$20 says no sane Democratic candidate wants you on their campaign committee...

You're gonna need that $20, so don't go wasting it on bets you'll never make good on.

and every Republican party member is hoping you are the Poster Child of Biden's Unity platform.

I absolutely do not care what a Nazi party member thinks of me.

A better way is actual unity. Common ground.

How can you find common ground with people who refuse to accept the results of the most secure election in our country's history?

That's not a rhetorical question, BTW...I really want to know how you find that common ground with someone opposed to the institution of democracy?

So I'm open to suggestions, but you have none.

Get drunk and/or laid with each other as mutually consenting adults.

How fucking juvenile.

Peace. Prosperity. Happiness.

Can't have any of those things so long as there are Nazis.

Again, I didn't make those rules...they did.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

So, what happens if Biden gets the minimum wage to $15 an hour?

Here's were the minimum wage is right now:

https://images.markets.businessinsi...14275e72-1200/state-2019-minimum-wage-map.png

In many states that more than doubles it overnight. Given the current state of business closures for Chinese Disease, will they just decide to close for good in those states? Will employers be able to take that big a wage hit? Will the states with larger portions of the population at minimum wage take a bigger hit?

https://i.insider.com/57211ba052bcd066018bf6b8?width=1200

How will this affect workers making $15 an hour or more?

My prediction is it is one of many blows that the economy will take causing recovery to grind to a halt... Will Biden blame Trump for that?

99% of the Democrats on this board would get a raise.

As the maps prove, higher density populations have higher costs and lower ones have lower costs. Obviously both states and cities have the option vote in higher taxes for themselves.

The bottom line is that option should still be played: State and city citizens have the option to vote in whatever they like. The Democrats are wrong to continually jam solutions to high density local or state problems across every square inch of the United States of America.

A national minimum wage is just a hidden tax on businesses to redistribute wealth without improving performance. The needs to be a better way than always sticking it to the middle class small businesses.

 

[Concart]

Federally speaking it would & would in some states.

Notice Texas has low wages, no wonder why Musk is moving there.

Agreed, in some places it might. In those areas, it's likely to raise both wages and cost of living. I don't think that's a bad thing.

 

[Sailor]

People will get paid more.

Prices will go up. It will be a wash. Actually it will be a negative for wait staff and bartenders. Owners will just pay minimum wage and do away with tips. Which is easily double that.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

So you want to "forgive and forget"?

You may want to move on from 400,000 dead of COVID and a failed Nazi coup, but I don't.

No.

Your anger is blinding you to seeing reason.

 

[LV426]

Minimum wage doesn't seem to do much to increase wealth.

That's not its goal.

Wealth is generated by production.

No, wealth is generated BY REVENUES (again, Econ 101...take a course).

If production doesn't increase then inflation will go up accordingly.

A higher MW will INCREASE production because a higher MW INCREASES demand. That increased demand is also the cause of increased hiring. So if anything, most of these businesses are going to have to expand in order to meet the demand that comes from lifting the wages of 10's of millions of people.

All minimum wage might do is temporarily decrease inequality.

The goal of the MW increase is to increase consumer demand. The other goal is that it increases wages by making the labor market more competitive at higher rates.

Long term it hurts smaller businesses.

Not at all. What hurts small businesses, like investopedia said, is poor management.

Do you think everyone who runs a business is good at running a business? Let's start there and break down all your preconceived notions about labor and wages.